My background isn’t music or art, I’ve always been interested in entrepreneurial things, from a young age, so I always find it harder to understand why people have trouble asking for money in exchange for their art / music.

Trying to work it out, so that I can help people get over those issues, I’ve spoken to a lot of artists and also a lot of managers and management teams, the people who frequently end up making the lions share of the money on behalf of the artists, so the artists don’t have to deal with the issue.

The secret is, there really isn’t any secret – other than maybe ignore some dick who tells you that you should dedicate your life to his entertainment and inspiration for free. What other job would anyone even consider working for free in?

But I know where the fear of charging comes from because its the same for anyone who follows their own path and chooses to put their own voice out into the world.

It’s not the same as selling double glazing or cars or insurance, you are selling something you put your heart and soul into, you are selling yourself, you are hanging your balls out there for all the world to see. That’s scary as hell. And because its so scary we try and avoid asking for the sale. We tell ourselves that if we give it away for free, then no one can tell us its shit or knock us down. But that’s not living the full creative life.

I wrote an article about what I’d call the ‘busker principle’ as part of the ‘creative secrets’ series,( I’d urge anyone who is interested in this kind of thing to subscribe for free, it will be delivered automatically near the end of the series. People tell us they get a lot of value from them. )

In brief it points out that that you have to spend those early ‘struggling years’ working on every aspect of your formula; your craft/skill level, your fear, your performance, learning to communicate with your fans and finding the best model to charge for your work.

Only when you have mastered all these on a small scale, will you be able to ‘scale up’ and grow from a secure foundation.

I’ll say it a million times, money is nothing more than a way of exchanging value.
It’s how we barter, it’s how we say “thank you – this is valuable to me.”
If you’re asking for it and no one is willing to pay you, then you’re asking the wrong people or you haven’t developed your skill enough yet. If you’re not asking for it, you have no one to blame but yourself.

For Nathan, if he were to ask my advice (and I appreciate that he didn’t) but if he did, I would say that if I were you I would start building a community of Pensilvanian, stoner, skater-punks today!

You’ve already got one fan who you know values your work more than enough to pay for it, you know that it’s effected his life. So invite him, tell him to bring some friends and start making products that they would be happy to BUY.

Hell I’d create a CD called ‘Stoner Skater Punks from Pensilvania’.

You can start building a community on sites like ning.com (that’s where we will be growing the SUBvert community when we launch the membership site).

I’m sure if you work at it, you will find that there are Stoner Skater Punks from places other than Pensilvania, I bet the worlds full of em!

The world is also full of artists who had to travel a bit to find their ideal market. Paul Smith and Vivian Westwood spring to mind, both hailed as Great British clothes designers, but both of who were largely mocked or ignored for the most part in their home country for much of their career. Paul Smith made his name when he found his market in Japan and Vivian Westwood when she focused on the States.

Hell, ‘The Hoff’ even became a rock star by touring the world until he found his musical home in Germany!
I’ll leave you to ponder that one :)

Paul.

I’ve been playing in bands in Manchester for the last 7 years. Each time band members have left and joined it has taken me a step closer to the vision of the band I wanted to be in back in 2001.It took me 5 years to put together a line up that I was completely happy with, making the music I wanted to make. The best thing you could do is to put notices up round your town, just stating what you want to do, what you play, who you listen to. Put on it that you’re not looking to make money, that you just want some like minded people to play with. Are there any open-mic nights around you? If there are, then get down to them. If you don’t have the courage to play anything then just go down and watch. When you have the courage, take your guitar. Play a few covers at first if you don’t feel confident in your own compostitions. They will also be hot-beds of people to play with.

Finding your voice might be difficult at first, but the only way to find it is to search for it. Sometimes it doesn’t come until you step up and open your mouth. I’ve sat for hours sometimes thinking of melodies for our tunes and the moment I open my mouth it comes out how I’d never expected…but always better. Playing cover versions is a good way to find it. Can help you find your natural way of singing. Just don’t try and sing like they do. If you want to improve your guitar technique, try playing covers in different styles, singing them in different styles. Will also go down a treat at the open-mic nights.

It costs very little to record at home. There is plenty of software out there that’s easy to use and you can pick up cheap mixers and little mixing desks. If what you’re doing is all acoustic then this would be a decent set up and you can create more than you realise once you start messing about with the effects in the software. That done, and the good ol’ myspace, and your music is out there. If you want to give it away to people than you can have it up there to download for free. Get onto music forums and just ask people to give it a listen. By this time, you might be getting some money – that dreaded word, more on that later – anyway, some run some CDs off at home and give it away at gigs.

Issues then arise around ambition and how much you feel you can sacrifice for it. This is where the money issue comes in. If you are all happy doing what you are doing, playing at the places you play, rehearsing and recording at home then all will be good and yes, who knows, money may come your way. You may be discovered just through simple word of mouth. This is what the majority of bands dream of, the chance to just live to play and write. Of course, that comes with a whole new set of dilemas.

If your ambition for this, the chance to live just to be in a band, comes from your very core then the issue of money becomes all the more pertinent. It is not then about making money, but about the need to spend money. Recording, promotion, travel, CD production, website, rehearsal room, a van, equipment repairs…all outgoings. The reality of the unsigned music scene across the country means that the vast majority of this will come out of your own pocket. I get that this is probably not what you’re thinking about, but these issues have been the cause of friction within our band and is all the more problematic because we are all good friends as well.

The reality for bands who have that level of burning ambition, that desire to just live to make music, is on the whole a poor one – we are the new starving artists. As I said previously, I’ve been playing in bands for the last 7 years in Manchester. The first incarnation was pretty much the scenario I described above. 4 of us playing acoustic music, printing our own CDs. All completey DIY. And yes, at this point we just gave it all away for free. As the band progressed, so did our ambitions. We released an EP on our own label a couple of years back, had a 7″ put out by a little label down in London, recorded an album for them, but were then dropped (we’d gone in a different direction to how they thought). So now we’re back at the point where we are putting our hands into our pockets simply to be the band that is striving to satisfy the ambition we have. Over the last 3 years we have probably spent close to £5000 on our band and still we are spending. Why are we spending? It’s certainly not because we can afford it, but it is a necessity to do the things we want to do at the level we want to do it.

I read a post somewhere recently that was bemoaning the fact that some bands charge for their CDs at gigs. Stating that bands should give away their music for free, that it is the best way to be heard. Well, yes it is, but it does not take into account the amount of money that some bands need to spend. Couple that with the fact that once you step into the world of gig promoters you’ll be lucky to make anywhere close to a tenth of what you’re spending. The only way to get through this period is to have help – a manager, a friend, just someone else to help – which we unfortunately don’t. Like the majority of unsigned bands, we do everything ourselves and it takes a lot of time, effort and money. So with all this in mind, when we release our new album, should we charge people to buy it, to download it? Oh, we know that we will not come anywhere close to making back what we have spent so some people may think we should cut our loses and just give it away, but if we sell enough, we will have the cash to print more, maybe it will be the only way for us to make some petrol money? Of course we want as many people as possible to hear it, but we also need to eat as none of us come from money, we have very little to fall back on in those terms.

Here’s where I think I can sum up the money point. Do I want to make money from my band? Yes. Does this cheapen the music I make? Not in any way. Why do I want to make money from my music? Because all I want to do is write and play music. I don’t want to drag myself to a day job so I can pay my rent, bills and eat. The goal of everyone in our band is to get to a point where we can give up our jobs and just make music. We don’t want to be rich, we don’t want to be famous, but we want to be able to live through making music. It is a burning desire, although once you get to this point it can be difficult to feel the warmth of the fire inside. Money can and do cause us major headaches…well, lack of it does.

The past few months have been dark days for us but we are seeing the light and this was in some way sparked by a message we got on myspace from a painter and tattoo artist who in Pensilvania who wanted to send us a painting he’d done for us. He told us that he bought a copy of our CD a while back and plays it regularly in his shop. These things make you realise that no matter how much you think you are banging your head against the wall and getting nowhere, you’re getting further than you think and are getting it through to the people who get it. Apparently we have a whole underground fanbase amongst the stoner skater punks of Pensilvania just waiting for us to come over and play…just need to get the money for the flight together ;)

I have been working with a lot of rich people and a lot of very successful people over the past years and one thing I learned, is that money doesn’t change the person you are:

best case scenario: it helps to spread the word and spread the good attitudes one has

worst case scenario: it helps spread that arrogant a**hole _I am not material but crave to have everything_ attitude

But anyways, the thing is, that usually good people will remain good and about the other I guess we do not have to waste any words on them =)

“Andrew,” I wouldn’t put down “computer music” if I were you. You can use music software solely to give you more ability with your music without limiting yourself at all. For example, why not just use it to mix your organic recordings? If you wanted to play two things on top of each other, for instance. Something that you can only do if you have an eight track or a computer, and with a computer it’s much easier.

Oh, and any time you feel like procrastination is getting you down, there’s nothing like watching the music video for “Certain Shade of Green” to slap you silly and get off your arse! In fact, I think I’m going to do that right now!

Best of luck to you!

I’ve given some of your advice some thought. And I’ve even done some of the things you’ve before.
I’ve always enjoyed the camaraderie you get when working with people that share the similar goals and ideas as me. I’d much rather work with people than do things on my own. I’ve tried to make my own music with guitars over the past 3 years & it has just never really done it for me.
Also, it is easy to make music on computers but to me personally, I want to actually make the music myself without too much aide from a computer program. In my experience, it’s best to not simply limit myself to one way of making music. I feel the same way when it comes to different genre’s of music. Why limit yourself to one specific thing? Not that there’s anything wrong with that of course heh :)
Anyway, It’s a totally different experience when clicking on a screen for hours on end than it is to craft music from your own hands, mind, body & soul. It’s a much more sobering experience for me personally.
Although that does not mean that I’m completely dismissing computer music production. I know I’ll get back on it the next time I get the urge to make something without having to worry about anyone else getting in the way. Computer music production has definitely helped me with my feeling less hopeless with making music though.

Music to me, is an amazing tool that is limitless in it’s range. I’ve always loved music for it’s melodic & sultry sounds as well as the way it can effect people is such a positive way(as well as negative of course).
I was shown this when my cousin died last year. My uncle was of course torn apart(some of my family members even got in a car accident on the way to the funeral. Everyone made it out fine thankfully) but there was one thing that would never fail to lift his spirits & give him hope.
We were at a family gathering where I was the DJ for the night and he asked me to play the song for him but his brother was trying to stop me from doing it(I’m sure he didn’t know how it would truly effect him) So of course I had to do it for him. It was uplifting to me to see the way that song, made his smile, & you could see how he song filled him with hope. He looked like a little kid. That moment will forever be burned into my mind as proof of the power of music, and the hope it is capable of bringing to people.
In way I guess that’s also why Incubus is one of my favorite bands, because rather than focusing on everything that is depressing; they focus more on things uplifting with thought provoking lyrics and great music.

End rant heh :)

_”Andrew”

Got me a couple of thoughts for Andrew too…

Having spent 15 years chasing the dream (musically) I had a few successes but ultimately local (UK) ones due mainly to the world being a much smaller place back then. I have now reverted back to my original love of illustration – the principles, however, are much the same in terms of ‘getting out there’ and the methods I have used to promote my art are the same I used in my music career. I have a global audience now though not just a local one.

In terms of cost, money, inspiration and becoming non-reliant on others: Learn to program music! There is so much free software around that can make it possible for you to create a professional in-home studio (example: Computer Music magazine’s free audio applications) And if you get a chance to try Reason DO! It is almost impossible not to be inspired using that program even if you only create a drum loop to jam along with. It’s easy to use despite it’s overwhelming first impression and the quality is fully professional. Tutorials are everywhere for this application too so you don’t even have to wait around for others to teach you.

On stress related and feeling helpless: Computers and the internet have allowed me to do several things more effectively, not least because I now have access to the entire world from my office/home. I can now create, perfect through feedback, promote and sell my work without the hassle of trying to shamelessly squeeze my self into a very clicky industry. I am empowered now to do everything myself. If only I had had these resources at my finger tips when I was trying to make it in the music industry I would surely be commenting now from my private Jet!

The whole process of trying to manage and promote yourself can feel like a real burden and should ideally be minimised especially when your core skills are creative ones. And in fact they can bog you down to such an extent that the creative side takes a back seat and the juices can even stop flowing. Something that I had experienced my self many times. My point (post rant) is that the whole (business and creative) process is now easy, free (if you already have a computer and sound card which are both pretty cheap these days – my previous studio was a crappy old laptop and was more than up to the task) and FUN! You put the effort in when you feel like it – join some like minded groups and most importantly fit the business side around your music making and not the other way round. Basically you don’t have to wait around any more… just get out there and make your own destiny.

Finally… make the music you like and make it for you not anyone else.

Hope that helps… a bit. ^_^

newsugar.co.uk

p.s. thanks for the “Truth about success” paragraph. I’m sure that helped a lot.

I can’t lie, I was intrigued with the suggestions proposed in the article. You’re pretty insightful & I have to respect that.
As for the money. A lot of what you said is true. I did grow up seeing people with money in a bad light, because well, many of them are not exactly the best people. In reality, of course I want to make money. Not that there’s anything wrong with Chicken and a bundle of wheat heh. I want to be able to get different instruments & try different things & experiment a bit more with music and of course, money is a big factor in my wanting to achieve all of that. Plus I plan on getting married & having a kid or kids eventually & I’m going to need money for that. But what I meant was, that money is not my only focus. And I have seen that there are people with money that are good people, the great fella’s of Incubus are a great example of that for sure.
And with attitude, I’m getting better. I can admit I’ve had quite the shitty attitude for a while but I’m trying to do what it takes to actually take steps to do what I want now. Though I’ve never really been big on New Years resolutions, I plan on procrastinating much less. The fact that it’s a new year is just a nice excuse to give the a little push.
Also, my friend is going to start teaching me how to read music. Which will be a great help overall. And I intend on actually taking a look at what you were saying about the keyboards being sold for cheap on eBay, that never even crossed my mind. So thanks for that.
Overall, I know we’re all human, we’re all going to make mistakes, we’re all going to have to sift through a lot of bull shit to get what we want or to get where we want to go. Anyway, I greatly appreciate your suggestions & your unbiased insight. For me, and for all of the people that visit the site, I think what you’re doing is great and truly appreciate it. Hope you all at SubVert Magazine had a great time over the holidays.

This part is in response to George:

Thanks George, I appreciate the encouragement. And you make some good points. I’ve actually been teaching myself to play guitar for a couple of years now. I’ve dabbled in Acoustic, Electric & Bass. I’ve come up with some little tunes that I think sound good. But I always run into the ever present issue of not being able to complete it or I just thing of a bunch of different little tunes that sound good but don’t usually fit together to be put in one song.
And I intend on getting a keyboard. My heart lies deeply within music but I really want to learn piano/keys & improve on my vocals as well as writing.
I enjoy the feedback & comradely I get when working with other people, but as I stated in the above article, I’ve tried to start bands before & it keeps falling through. But that doesn’t mean I’m going to give up of course. I would much rather work with other people. For the time being I’ve been working on my own & trying to progress creatively.

Thanks again for the feeback
_”Andrew”